1 (edited by Clypxy 2008-05-09 13:07:47)

Topic: The dreaded barrè chords

I've been strumming my guitar for about 6-7 months now; and I'm making some progress i can only assume! I've even managed to learn the open, but yet difficult version of C-major, and now also the other open chords seems quite easy to get by. That's what encouraged me to learn the dreaded barre chords. They seemed so difficult, and because of that I've always tried avoiding them - which meant I couldn't play many of the nice tunes here on chordie.

Noweven the big F-Chord doesn't scare me any longer. I've got the basic shapes down, and it sounds quite nice most of the time I think. I now get by with a little strength from my thumb and it's not that difficult any more. What I am struggeling with and can't get right, is the more advanced barre shapes. Like those of: GM, FM, GM7, F7, CM#7.

It's very frustrating because I can't seem to get all the strings to ring out clearly as i strum/pick those chord shapes, and sometimes one or two strings are fully muted.., regardless of how much i practise i put into making it right. And besides, I really want to get those chord shapes down, because i want to make use of them in one of my  favorite songs " MY WAY," by Frank Sinatra.

So here comes the point i guess; any players out there presumably having a good barre grip that could perhaps give me sone tricks or hint i could try to make it sound better? Thank you! I am by the way thankful for any advice smile

(A)                 (C#)     (D-barrè)                  (Cm#)(Bm)
Stand by your guitar, and tell the world you love it!

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

You'll see lots of posts on the topic. A prevalent theme is keep your thumb on the back of the neck and your palm should never touch the back of the neck. Search the previous threads on the topic for much more in depth info.
If you can make an F bar you should be well on your way to making all the chords you mentioned. It helped me to practice making the F first and then practicing removing the finger you need to make the alternate shape, with F and Bminor shapes you can play all of the above by removing fingers...then there's the dreaded B (are you out there Zurf?!). If you're not already familiar with the shapes and what they become as you move them up the fret board, have a look at the chord index on this website. There is a real "light bulb over your head" moment when you realize you can use 3 or 4 shapes and play dozens of chords just by moving them up and down. That revelation is well worth the effort

I used to be disgusted; now I try to be amused.
Elvis Costello

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

The number one thing you can do is place your chording thumb on the back of the guitar neck. Draw an imaginary line on the back of the neck and  place your thumb in the middle to lower third of the back of the neck. This will give you better leverage and expand your reach. Try to avoid the 'wrap-around' thumb technique in the early stages of learning barre chords. This is a bad habit to develope and it limits your reach.........Good luck, get ready for some pain.

Peace and Guitars,
SouthPaw41L

Give everything but up.

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

Thanks for good advice, I'll try to perfect my technique then.
I think I'll get around the easier shapes and change quicker as i build up strength and speed, but i still find the shapes F7 and Fm7 to be very, very tricky as it is always one or two strings not ringing out, but is totally muted. And I'just learned that they all can be used as you move the shapes up and down, and yes it was a big light bulb when i realized it smile Too bad i cant play those 2 types properly in reality then, still thankful for advice on those two spesific shapes though .

(A)                 (C#)     (D-barrè)                  (Cm#)(Bm)
Stand by your guitar, and tell the world you love it!

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

Keep at them. I'm glad to hear you had the "lighth bulb" moment. It's very gratifiying

I used to be disgusted; now I try to be amused.
Elvis Costello

6 (edited by Seanibus 2008-05-03 18:52:29)

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

The thumb position is key, though the whole thing is about practice. I finally managed a decent Barre chord after taking on some songs that are easy, open position songs, but with one basic Barre cord - like Maggie May, which is all A, G, D, and Em except for a single tricky little F#m7 (at the point where the lyric goes "Couldn't have Tried..."). That strengthened my grip and got my fingers used to whipping around from open position to a Barre chord. Handle a couple like that, then move up to a song where there is a sliding series of Barre chords, like REM's Don't Go Back to Rockville, where the lick that starts "I know it might sound strange..." goes:
B-VII    A-V    G#m    C#m-IV    Bm    A    Asus4
That will get your fingers used to moving up and down the fretboard smoothly.

I'm no Barre Chord expert by any means, but that's the sequence that's gotten me to the point where I can convincingly fake my way through it most of the time.

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

Also, make a mental adjustment.  They aren't "dreaded" for crying out loud.  Get it in your head that something is impossible, or that you should fear it, and sure enough, you will.

It takes practice to barre well.  So practice.

Someday we'll win this thing...

[url=http://www.aclosesecond.com]www.aclosesecond.com[/url]

8 (edited by Clypxy 2008-05-03 23:46:20)

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

Thanks for advice once again guys, I'll just keep pushing my finger into those sharp steel strings. And perhaps when I find the right technique and/or place to hold they'll ring out. I will try those songs as well, thank you. I wont deny the fact that my fingers REALLY hurts though sad

(A)                 (C#)     (D-barrè)                  (Cm#)(Bm)
Stand by your guitar, and tell the world you love it!

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

geoaguiar wrote:

Keep at them. I'm glad to hear you had the "lighth bulb" moment. It's very gratifiying

I had that "light bulb" moment today. For two weeks I practiced going from open chords to barre chords in the E shape and the A shape. I grab my guitar every morning and today it seem to sound so right. Just proves what I've read on this site, Practice is key.

Badeye....   cool

one caper after another

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

and remember if you don't like the key its in try moving it. that gives you different chord shapes. chordie has a transposition tool which works on many songs . of course you have to stay within your vocal range but you might find that shifting key occasionally helps there too.

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

badeye wrote:
geoaguiar wrote:

Keep at them. I'm glad to hear you had the "lighth bulb" moment. It's very gratifiying

I had that "light bulb" moment today. For two weeks I practiced going from open chords to barre chords in the E shape and the A shape. I grab my guitar every morning and today it seem to sound so right. Just proves what I've read on this site, Practice is key.

Badeye....   cool

Makes it all worth it. Keeps you coming back, doesn't it? Once you get that moment, you have  a hard time putting it down. Don't play in the shower!!!! Just skip the shower!!1

I used to be disgusted; now I try to be amused.
Elvis Costello

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

This might be bad form, but a friend of mine does it and it helps him quite a bit.  He's fine on the major barre chords, but when he tries the minors (specifically the F#m), one of the strings always sounded muted.  Instead of having his middle finger just hang there unemployed, he puts it over his index finger--sort of a double-decker barre.  That little bit of extra pressure makes the chord ring true.

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

I've got nothing for you but sympathy and comeraderie.  Good luck and keep practicing.

- Zurf

Granted B chord amnesty by King of the Mutants (Long live the king).
If it comes from the heart and you add a few beers... it'll be awesome! - Mekidsmom
When in doubt ... hats. - B.G. Dude

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

25Frankster wrote:

This might be bad form, but a friend of mine does it and it helps him quite a bit.  He's fine on the major barre chords, but when he tries the minors (specifically the F#m), one of the strings always sounded muted.  Instead of having his middle finger just hang there unemployed, he puts it over his index finger--sort of a double-decker barre.  That little bit of extra pressure makes the chord ring true.

That's actually good form.  I've seen that recommended a lot by really good teachers and players.  It also helps if you find your hand getting tired.

Someday we'll win this thing...

[url=http://www.aclosesecond.com]www.aclosesecond.com[/url]

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

If you have access to one, it could be a good idea to practice some on an electric withh low action. It will help your fingers get used to the somewhat stressful positions. working your accustic is still the only real way to get the strength and stamina you need though. Also if you can get your hands on a bass and work scale and chords on it, you will really develope some serious strength and flexibility in you hand.

"Nobody paints by ear so why would I play guitar by sight?" hmm

16 (edited by Clypxy 2008-05-08 13:42:03)

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

I've always wanted to play bass, but i dont know how...sure i can play a few notes, but not properly.
I've always wanted to play Cello as well i think, off topic i guess.

I'll just try to press harder then, at least some of the nicer strings ring out on the harder barre chords.

Do you think cello is harder than guitar? and is bass harder? Harder to play i mean.

(A)                 (C#)     (D-barrè)                  (Cm#)(Bm)
Stand by your guitar, and tell the world you love it!

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

Cello is fretless, so it's going to be tough.  Bass is generally an easier technical instrument, but a harder theoretical one.  It is difficult to play bass well without a good understanding of scales and chord theory.     If all you want to do is pound out root notes, it's not difficult.  Guitar isn't really that hard to play once you have your hands trained.

Someday we'll win this thing...

[url=http://www.aclosesecond.com]www.aclosesecond.com[/url]

18 (edited by Clypxy 2008-05-09 13:06:49)

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

Anything is easy if you have already learned it smile
Fingerpicking and chordchanges + strumming i thought was very difficult at first; now i can do blindfolded. But i still find playing solo arrangements, or lead guitar very difficult. And of course the advanced barre chords!

I can strum those shapes and get them to cling, but while fingerpicking a pattern i dont. Because while strumming i can move my index up and down and adjust so that those loose strings keep ringing. With fingerpicking i find that i have less time between the changes, and lifting up my index in middle of a barre chord, say HM - HM7 ( In this case my index need to go up a little to get the string i lift of to ring) i find that the chord changes are less...mhm - let's say "Smooth". Hope at least some of you understood this..

To me it looks like i only have about two things to do. Eather keep practising and hope for the best, or assume that my index finger will grow larger or bigger something ( Not likely - unless i start gaining weight)

And btw: A little of topic here, but im listening to a song and I'm trying to figure out the fingerpicking pattern. I have already found one, but im not sure if thats the right one. Can anyone listen to the norwegian love-song and tell how the pattern goes?? ( It's a basic pattern i think - of some advanced kind) Here's the link to the tune: http://www.norsknettskole.no/fag/ressur … v/hunstmo/

( As you enter the page you'll have to scroll down and choose song number 28, "kjærlighetsvisa," remember to turn the volume=))    ( Thanks if trying, i really wanna figure out the pattern to this one, and sorry if it's not allowed to post links)

(A)                 (C#)     (D-barrè)                  (Cm#)(Bm)
Stand by your guitar, and tell the world you love it!

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

http://www.justinguitar.com/en/CH-006-BasicBarres.php

Best advice I've seen for barres.  Just getting the technique down right is the biggest help.  For the 7th and minor chords, you just need to make sure that your barre is solid and going across all 6 strings.  That's actually how I started with them is to make sure that my barre can press all 6 strings.  Anyway, just look at this site and I think it should help at least a little.

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

Someone told me there were something like 4 different shapes to memorize for the barre chords. They told me once I learn them, I'll be on my way. Can anyone tell me these shapes or advise a web site that will diagram them out for me?  Thanks!!!

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

To anyone looking to learn guitar at home I highly recommend lessons offered by Desi Serna.  He does a fantastic job at presenting a well planned lesson format for all levels of guitar experience and all at a reasonable price.  In most cases, theory of any type can potentially be boring.  But I find his materials adequately combine theory with popular and recognizable music to make learning fun.

Here is the link to his website: http://Guitar-Music-Theory.com

Enjoy!

Tim

Re: The dreaded barrè chords

mainecanoe wrote:

Someone told me there were something like 4 different shapes to memorize for the barre chords. They told me once I learn them, I'll be on my way. Can anyone tell me these shapes or advise a web site that will diagram them out for me?  Thanks!!!

There are five basic chord shapes for major chords, and you probably already know them.

C A G E and D

Each of those can be played open or closed.

Someday we'll win this thing...

[url=http://www.aclosesecond.com]www.aclosesecond.com[/url]